When I asked about topics you want me to explore here, friendship was one of the big ones. I’ve spent a lot of the weekend thinking about it (and it’s been prevalent in my mind anyway these days as I watch my thirteen-year-old daughter try to navigate the Hunger Games-esque territory of teenage female friendship) and the whole topic just feels so…big. As much time as I’ve spent writing about, talking about, and considering romantic relationships, I’ve never really dissected friendships. So I’d like to get a thread started and see what themes emerge and what your experiences have been.
A few questions to get the conversation going.Note: your answers don’t need to be specific to female friendship, that’s just what I happen to be thinking about.
What are the first feelings or thoughts that come up when you consider the topic of friendship in your life today? Does it feel like a source of hurt and anxiety for you or a place of comfort and fulfillment?
How would you characterize the role friendship plays in your life today? For example: Totally critical—I rely on my friends as my primary support system; My friends are really important in my life, but my immediate family/partnership is more of a focus; I’ve never really relied on friends as a primary source of support.
Are you comfortable with ebbs and flows in friendships, or do they stress you out?
Do you tend to keep a very tight, small circle or spread your friendship love far and wide?
Have you ever had a bad breakup with a close friend? What was that like?
Alright, go! Also, feel free to riff on whatever comes to mind if none of the questions above feel like what you really want to talk about, or know.
Leave a comment to engage in the conversation. I’ll be very active in the comments, but won’t be receiving or reading emails, so please don’t hit reply. xo
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1. So many feelings-all can be true at the same time-complicated, exhausting, stressful, necessary, lovely, fun, beautiful, fulfilling.
2. I have 5-7 intimate friendships. I find each one brings something different to my world. For example, my childhood bestie "gets" my past history and family of origin. She is more like a sister. Friendships forged during my "mom" years have tapered a bit since we are all navigating various aspects of life. I'd say my deepest connections are with my friends whom I exercise with. Something about running and biking with someone for 20-30 years.....if those miles could talk.
3. The ebs and flows 100% stress me out!!! Especially since becoming sober. The gifts of clarity and authenticity definitely "weeded out" many relationships. I found I only desired meaningful friendships- sans gossip and shallowness. I never wanted to hurt anyone, but I became honest with who I was and how being around certain friends made me feel afterwards. UGH, still hard to put words to.
4. I draw a line between " friend" vs " acquaintances" . I'd describe my friendships as a tight circle.
5. 2 breakups....OUCH. First with someone I thought was the closest best-est friend I'd EVER had...I was
blindsided when it came out that she was in love with me. After 20 years we have reconnected, she now divorced and has a lovely same sex partner. Second friend, (I still have guilt regarding how poorly I ended it) was 15 years older, "smarter" about everything-parenting, cycling, traveling, cooking.... I always felt I was never good enough, so I did the easy, cowardly thing and ghosted her. Not one of my finer moments.
After traveling for so many years, and moving around my entire adult life, I am sad to say I do not have any friends that I really consider close like while I was growing up. Now that I am settled in Bali, I deeply desire to make friends and ive had the opportunity a lot but I do not feel that true closeness like I had with my lifelong childhood friends. I can still always reach out to those women but life has taken us down very different ways. So i am relearning what it means to engage on adult female friendships and i have found it HARD! I question whether these women even want me to reach out even though they have done nothing to make me think that. Quite the opposite. So every time i say no for self care or just not wanting to do something with someone, I have the worst FOMO and i feel shame to reingage. Its a trip! I have so much love and support to give and i need the same. I am following this thread because i know there are loads of women out there who feel the same challenges---now how do we improve on the tools we have so that we can all receive the love and closeness we desire? 💖🙏
I am outside of Seattle, WA on holiday (I live in Sydney, Australia) and staying with my dearest and oldest friend. Choosing to live in another country has been (12 years) has reflected what friendship is and what it is not, as well as, not living close to those friends I grew up with. So many people have been in my life and now I say, for a season. Except this friend, my best friend, who I cannot express how grateful I have in my life. What a gift.
One thing that has become more clear is the my most cherished friendships always tap into a core wound: Abandonment. Trust comes next. The story is: 'I can't really trust you because (eventually) you abandon me (through not responding, flaking, 'not really being there.').' I am starting to see this for what it is...a very young part of me that was once wounded in this way and is trying to protect me from it happening again. I think every single friend I have had has 'failed' me in this particular way. I am learning to take responsibility for this part, care for it and not believe that old story anymore. That said, it takes great discernment to know when someone actually does not have my best interest at heart. I am learning to trust myself and not feed relationships that are not reciprocal, all the while not blaming people for not being in the place I want them to be when it comes to ME. :). I have had a bad break up with a friend and while we worked it out, I have to admit that my young abandoned part still wonders if I can trust her. It's been a really long time since we've broken up and gotten back together. What this teaches me is that I have more work to do on forgiveness and letting go, but that my young tender parts also need more tending. Thank you for the inquiry, so lovely!
I don’t have any “friends” to call and chat and hang out with. Even tho I am an extrovert I stay close to my family and consider them my best friends. I want to change that and am working on it. Finding sober friends to hang out with is difficult and being older seems really difficult for me
Whew...this is a big topic and those are great questions. I had a group of girlfriends that I thought would be my "forever friends" and when I quit drinking, I no longer got invited to the girl's trips and slowing those women have faded from my life except one of them- the only one of them that asked me how I was doing when I quit drinking and kept up with me.
Now, as I've gotten older and slowly made connections with women I do group therapy with, I realize that old group of friends wasn't actually comfortable for me. I always knew someone was talking about me behind my back and I wasn't authentic, it was about being part of the group, not showing up as myself. It is bittersweet to realize friends you used to have fun with and connect with are now in the past- and I wonder, were we ever that close? I think so but it was only for that specific time in our lives.
Now I have a handful of close friends but I find adulthood to be lonely and I wish I felt more secure in my friendships.
I do tell my kiddos that friends are great but the most important relationship they have is with themselves.
The past 3 years, the pandemic and the illness and death of my mother have been cause for me to to seriously question the meaning of friendship.
I am 66 years old. I have always been a people pleaser, always cared deeply about what others think of me, always tried to get along to, to be agreeable, likeable, pleasant and harmonious in relationships.
So what I have come to realize about friends is, that for me, there are two types. There are friends and there are FRIENDS.
Friends are the people I went to high school an/or college with, former coworkers, people in social circles, people whom I keep in touch with through yearly holiday greetings, intermittent social gatherings, clubs, church, support groups, etc.. These are friends I like for the most part and don't mind and often enjoy spending limited time with. Conversation with these friends is generally superficial relating to topics like the weather, family updates, travel, music, books, movies, recipes, sports and projects. Deep dive conversations with these friends are infrequent.
FRIENDS on the other hand are people wherein lives a deep, genuine trust, respect and love. There are no "off topic" conversations with these FRIENDS. Conversations with these friends are about feelings, beliefs, politics, religion, values, regrets, passions, hopes, dreams, insecurities, the heart and soul of real life "things". These are FRIENDS where there are no walls, no barriers, no pretenses, where I can be who I am all of it..the good, bad and ugly and will not be judged. FRIENDS are FRIENDS I can count on to always be there in all life times. These FRIENDS know too that they can always count on me.
Friendship is a biggie topic! Thanks so much Laura! It’s also a very heavy topic for me. I’ve always had 3 or 4 “quality” friends. I’ve never been one to have a “few hundred” friends. Yes - I’ve had acquaintances and colleagues but those are different.
My friends are my family and I treat them as such. In my early adult life, I had different expectations I think. But honestly as everything does eventually change, friendahips can as well. They change, shift, adapt, pivot into different forms and kinds.
As we get older, it’s very different to make new friends. Everybody’s lives seem to be more complicated, busier, and maybe not as flexible.
I have been hurt very deeply by friends and maybe even more so than romantic relationships. I treasure them in a very different way. I know specifically after one heartache, I did change my expectations from friends. And to this day I do remind myself of that.
Being sober and through out my recovery journey, friendships are even more challenging and I will continue that in another comment.
This is really neat to have this forum and someone I respect so much inviting me to chime in with my thoughts so I appreciate this - and you!
1) My first thoughts and feelings when I think of friendships in my life today... well, a smile comes to my face. I am thinking of my recent birthday party where I had so many nerves and anxiety that people wouldn't come, or if they came they wouldn't have a good time, I certainly didn't expect them to bring me gifts, etc and the result was such a wonderful lovely time where I had the perfect mix of friends show up - from my very best friend since middle school (I was so thrilled she came because she has a busy life as a mom and lives an hour away - this friendship I had a story that I always needed to be the one to come to HER and not put the burden on asking her to come to MY things), to my work colleagues that I formed a friendship with over the past year and half, to my gaggle of theatre friends, to my friend from vet school, to my new romantic partner. I cried when everyone left tears of such gratitude while reading my birthday cards. It was a reminder that I am loved and in the voice of Stewart Smiley - gosh darnit, people like me!
2) The role of my friendships in terms of my support system - I would say pretty important/even with my family and new romantic partnership. Especially my work bestie who I can text with about cases and they "get it". That has been really helpful.
3) I'm comfortable with ebbs and flows
4) I like a tight circle, but that is expanding some as I make more and more connections in theatre. I was really struck by observing the guy I'm dating who is an extrovert and I swear has more friends than anyone I have ever met and seems to actually be close with most of them, not just random party acquaintances etc. It's such a stark difference to me and has been so interesting to observe and reflect on and is something I like about him.
5) Possibly in middle school or something, no deep wounds are coming to mind. Of my friendships that didn't last, most just sort of peetered out as we aged and found other interests or moved or whatever. Some of them I can reconnect with years later and it's like no time has passed and others I never had a chance or motivation to reconnect with.
One thing that I am so thrilled about in sobriety is how I didn't lose any friendships. I am comfortable bringing NA alternatives to gatherings etc and so all my friendships just carried on, most with not a lot of discussion around my decision to get sober.
Oct 25, 2022·edited Oct 25, 2022Liked by Laura McKowen
This one is big for me right now. My childhood best friend and I had a break up around 12 years ago. She set a boundary that I misinterpreted as rejection. I was in a tough period with my husband (we separated at the time and this friend did NOT support my staying in the marriage). Looking back now, I see how brave she was in setting this boundary and removing her friendship/support. I felt betrayed and so angry. It wasn't until I stopped drinking (10 years later) that I re-examined all of this and had a different perspective. While my husband and I worked through a LOT and grew a ton, I now can recognize that she was putting her well being first (it hurt her too much to see me abuse myself and stay stuck - I was in a bad place). About a year after getting sober, she called me to tell me she has breast cancer. The first words out of my mouth were, "I love you and I'm so sorry." I didn't miss a beat, could not harbor any of the old resentment and I just needed her to know that I am here and I don't care that we had drifted. The last 12 months have been us repairing our friendship and it has been beautiful. And one of my biggest lessons in recovery.
This is a fraught one for me at the moment. I was heartbroken by the friends who were just not there for me when my daughter became seriously unwell. It is true what they say - no one brings you a casserole when your child has a mental illness. It is shocking when it happens and for me coping with the distress at feeling abandoned was the second worst thing about my daughters illness (the worst being her suffering and the suffering of our whole family).
I am grateful that some other friends were rock solid, including one who had been more of an acquaintance and who just became a lifeline.
I am very sure that I have not always been there for my friends so I continue to work on getting over what happened with my friends but im not sure that I will.
This is an interesting topic, as since becoming sober its changed. I need to remind myself that change is a process. I'm a different friend now i'm sober.
I find myself wanting more connection, more truth, more love, more and my current circle of friends not being able to step up. Its a process.....
1. friendship in my life today is both invaluable and lacking; It's neither hurt nor comfort- I have some friendships but its an area of opportunity that I'm actively trying to improve post-getting sober
2. I'm seeing more and more how important close friendships are and what it takes to keep them close, and wishing I'd put more effort and time into them rather than backburner them at the expense of my relationship and own inability to be vulnerable
3. I'm mostly comfortable with them and don't require constant contact, but am realizing that for others this can be seen as not being close or not caring
4. somewhere in between, I haven't had that tight-knit 'friends' style group since high-school or college
5. not in adulthood, just gradual growing apart (although as I typed this I almost forgot about the one who cheated with my significant other, which I wouldn't categorize as a friend breakup but do realize it led to some serious trust issues)
Navigating adult friendships after getting sober and realizing how much connection I didn't have in active drinking and how many friendships I lost because of it, has been so hard. There are a few that have always been there but I never really let people 'in' for a very long time, and am actively trying to fix that now. It's hard and lonely. It's not exactly what you described below, not friendships as fill-ins, but as far as time and energy spent my friendships have always tapered and taken a backseat to my relationships, which I regret even as I'm married and happy in that space.
As a source of comfort, I think about a quote my best friend in Chicago of 30 years sent me recently on friendship, the basically said that in your 40s your good friendships basically get sized down to a single dot. Like your really close friendships. And it makes me laugh - it’s probably true, too. We see each other about 4 times per year and integrate each other into our own families, but she is one of my top 5 most important people in my life, for sure. Lately I have become kind of a housecat and am busy with work, kids, being sober - and my casual group of girlfriends, my social network, has drifted off. I know they are still doing the same things, but I have changed, and I’m okay with that. I’ve gotten closer to my kids, closer to people that I play tennis with, since we share that in common, and close to a few people at work. I’m good with that. As a source of hurt and anxiety, I often think about my 14yo daughter when you ask a friendships, and MAN she is having a TIME, as a freshman at a new school. She had a wonderful time at summer school, and then the worst first month of school ever with a couple of groups of girls, and they can get SO MEAN. She inserted herself as the freshman counselor, of which she is completely not qualified, and on shaky legs to begin with, and every bad and worse thing that could have happened, did. She was basically told to get herself out of all of this perpetuating drama, or leave school - it was hard telling her that much of what she was doing wasn’t “wrong” but that she needed to stop inserting herself on what was right, and get distance from what all was going on. She is also trapped in the things we tell ourselves, and having to own some of her own mistakes. Makes me hurt for her. And yet, she is the one at lunch who will walk up to anyone to make a friend. Funny that you ask about breakups with friends - my husband of 25yrs has always been a priority to me, and my best friend, and others have kind of drifted in and out with that. I have left a lot of people behind, which I would like to change as I become more independent, but no, as an adult I haven’t had a bad breakup with a friend.
Such mixed feelings about this topic because I have only now really started to trust female friendship after a lifetime of being treated horribly by friends in my past. Now I have 2 friends I trust, but my primary relationships are my partner and my sisters. I am 4 years sober, and I am feeling confident enough to be a lot more deliberate about friendships. So if I meet a woman I think is a good fit, I am making a conscious effort to pursue friendships, which is totally new for me. But it is difficult to find friends who aren't wine moms as a personality.
I believe it is up to me to get out in community and get involved in activities that bring people together.
I am in long term recovery and am separated from my husband of 25 years. Working through grief and loss is a highly sensitive space to be alone in, but I imagine more common than not, especially when your doing the work that involves childhood trauma.
I am in a psycho drama group and I have a recovery coach, so there is that support.
I am ok being alone, but to find the people that have compassion and live with truth and vulnerability are rare finds. You would think in the recovery world one would have an easier time being seen.
I am a Seattle native, in my early 60's, very open and easy going. Love being out in nature with my regal hound, it would be so nice to meet up for a nice convo:)
Someone responded that they were having trouble leaving a comment (hi, Kristin Kent!) so I'm posting this with her permission:
+++++++
Hello, Laura sent a callout about friendship. I can't leave a comment for some reason, so here it is. If you could forward, please and thanks.
Great topic, Laura.
The first thing that comes up for me with friendship is loneliness. Friends, to me, are situational. I have one friend I could share anything with. One. And because of our schedules we don't prioritize each other. I'm envious of people with girlfriends, with a solid group they see often, and can depend on.
I feel alone a lot. I'm used to it, it's been like this for a long time. I tried to shape-shift myself to belong for many years, often feeling rejected because I could really never make friendships stick. So I went to 'locals' where I knew other people would constantly be there, that I could talk to. They were never friends, but at least they were there.
I'm older now, and don't see myself making 'true' friendships at this point in my life. It's painful to think about, and it's a topic I avoid. So, what comes up for me? Loneliness.
I treasure my friendships and I work hard to make sure they are kept fairly strong. I have a small handful of life-long friends that I still, after 40+ years, keep in touch with and see, a couple more than the other two. My husband actually gets jealous of how much time I spend trying to find time to spend with my friends. I love him, and he is a great husband, but it isn't that same as my Girlfriends. I have had some friends come and go in my life, which at the time hurt a lot, but one moves on. :)
Friendship feels like a bottomless need for me. I can never seem to feel full of it or secure in it. I make friends easily and have many, yet my desire for deep, authentic connection (and attention TBH) feels too much. I am always working to fill my own cup. In sobriety, I lost two 40 year friendships that were like family to me. One was complete cut off (not my choice) and the other was a slow fade. I am left so confused, angry, disappointed, hurt, and more. Codependency and people pleasing are my middle names, a constant work in progress. My husband is the best companion but he is not my girlfriend. I have made new friends and great connection in sobriety, but I had a long history with my lifelong girlfriends that can't be replaced. I don't have a full understanding of what happened and I never will. It is really hard for me to let go. Thanks for bringing up this topic, Laura!
Oct 24, 2022·edited Oct 24, 2022Liked by Laura McKowen
My friendships are a source of tremendous strength for me. I have a small circle (4-6) folks who know everything about my journey & who I trust with my life. I also have a broader circle of good friends & acquaintances. Over the past 5 years I have fought very hard to be a good friend & to build strong connections. I know that I am very fortunate & I don’t take the relationships for granted. These friendships transcend romantic relationships & are a constant in my life. I also ended two friendships that just were just not supportive - always critical - never positive- mean to others. Difficult decisions - but such a relief after it was done.
Personally, I'm really curious about a phenomenon I noticed pretty early on: that some women (and I'm sure men and non-binary folks too, but please comment?) valued their friendships as much (and sometimes more!) as romantic partnerships while others seemed to use friendships more as fill-ins until they found a partner, at which point they'd basically bounce.
To begin...THANK YOU for doing this!!!
1. So many feelings-all can be true at the same time-complicated, exhausting, stressful, necessary, lovely, fun, beautiful, fulfilling.
2. I have 5-7 intimate friendships. I find each one brings something different to my world. For example, my childhood bestie "gets" my past history and family of origin. She is more like a sister. Friendships forged during my "mom" years have tapered a bit since we are all navigating various aspects of life. I'd say my deepest connections are with my friends whom I exercise with. Something about running and biking with someone for 20-30 years.....if those miles could talk.
3. The ebs and flows 100% stress me out!!! Especially since becoming sober. The gifts of clarity and authenticity definitely "weeded out" many relationships. I found I only desired meaningful friendships- sans gossip and shallowness. I never wanted to hurt anyone, but I became honest with who I was and how being around certain friends made me feel afterwards. UGH, still hard to put words to.
4. I draw a line between " friend" vs " acquaintances" . I'd describe my friendships as a tight circle.
5. 2 breakups....OUCH. First with someone I thought was the closest best-est friend I'd EVER had...I was
blindsided when it came out that she was in love with me. After 20 years we have reconnected, she now divorced and has a lovely same sex partner. Second friend, (I still have guilt regarding how poorly I ended it) was 15 years older, "smarter" about everything-parenting, cycling, traveling, cooking.... I always felt I was never good enough, so I did the easy, cowardly thing and ghosted her. Not one of my finer moments.
After traveling for so many years, and moving around my entire adult life, I am sad to say I do not have any friends that I really consider close like while I was growing up. Now that I am settled in Bali, I deeply desire to make friends and ive had the opportunity a lot but I do not feel that true closeness like I had with my lifelong childhood friends. I can still always reach out to those women but life has taken us down very different ways. So i am relearning what it means to engage on adult female friendships and i have found it HARD! I question whether these women even want me to reach out even though they have done nothing to make me think that. Quite the opposite. So every time i say no for self care or just not wanting to do something with someone, I have the worst FOMO and i feel shame to reingage. Its a trip! I have so much love and support to give and i need the same. I am following this thread because i know there are loads of women out there who feel the same challenges---now how do we improve on the tools we have so that we can all receive the love and closeness we desire? 💖🙏
I am outside of Seattle, WA on holiday (I live in Sydney, Australia) and staying with my dearest and oldest friend. Choosing to live in another country has been (12 years) has reflected what friendship is and what it is not, as well as, not living close to those friends I grew up with. So many people have been in my life and now I say, for a season. Except this friend, my best friend, who I cannot express how grateful I have in my life. What a gift.
One thing that has become more clear is the my most cherished friendships always tap into a core wound: Abandonment. Trust comes next. The story is: 'I can't really trust you because (eventually) you abandon me (through not responding, flaking, 'not really being there.').' I am starting to see this for what it is...a very young part of me that was once wounded in this way and is trying to protect me from it happening again. I think every single friend I have had has 'failed' me in this particular way. I am learning to take responsibility for this part, care for it and not believe that old story anymore. That said, it takes great discernment to know when someone actually does not have my best interest at heart. I am learning to trust myself and not feed relationships that are not reciprocal, all the while not blaming people for not being in the place I want them to be when it comes to ME. :). I have had a bad break up with a friend and while we worked it out, I have to admit that my young abandoned part still wonders if I can trust her. It's been a really long time since we've broken up and gotten back together. What this teaches me is that I have more work to do on forgiveness and letting go, but that my young tender parts also need more tending. Thank you for the inquiry, so lovely!
I don’t have any “friends” to call and chat and hang out with. Even tho I am an extrovert I stay close to my family and consider them my best friends. I want to change that and am working on it. Finding sober friends to hang out with is difficult and being older seems really difficult for me
Whew...this is a big topic and those are great questions. I had a group of girlfriends that I thought would be my "forever friends" and when I quit drinking, I no longer got invited to the girl's trips and slowing those women have faded from my life except one of them- the only one of them that asked me how I was doing when I quit drinking and kept up with me.
Now, as I've gotten older and slowly made connections with women I do group therapy with, I realize that old group of friends wasn't actually comfortable for me. I always knew someone was talking about me behind my back and I wasn't authentic, it was about being part of the group, not showing up as myself. It is bittersweet to realize friends you used to have fun with and connect with are now in the past- and I wonder, were we ever that close? I think so but it was only for that specific time in our lives.
Now I have a handful of close friends but I find adulthood to be lonely and I wish I felt more secure in my friendships.
I do tell my kiddos that friends are great but the most important relationship they have is with themselves.
The past 3 years, the pandemic and the illness and death of my mother have been cause for me to to seriously question the meaning of friendship.
I am 66 years old. I have always been a people pleaser, always cared deeply about what others think of me, always tried to get along to, to be agreeable, likeable, pleasant and harmonious in relationships.
So what I have come to realize about friends is, that for me, there are two types. There are friends and there are FRIENDS.
Friends are the people I went to high school an/or college with, former coworkers, people in social circles, people whom I keep in touch with through yearly holiday greetings, intermittent social gatherings, clubs, church, support groups, etc.. These are friends I like for the most part and don't mind and often enjoy spending limited time with. Conversation with these friends is generally superficial relating to topics like the weather, family updates, travel, music, books, movies, recipes, sports and projects. Deep dive conversations with these friends are infrequent.
FRIENDS on the other hand are people wherein lives a deep, genuine trust, respect and love. There are no "off topic" conversations with these FRIENDS. Conversations with these friends are about feelings, beliefs, politics, religion, values, regrets, passions, hopes, dreams, insecurities, the heart and soul of real life "things". These are FRIENDS where there are no walls, no barriers, no pretenses, where I can be who I am all of it..the good, bad and ugly and will not be judged. FRIENDS are FRIENDS I can count on to always be there in all life times. These FRIENDS know too that they can always count on me.
Friends are many. FRIENDS are few!
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Friendship is a biggie topic! Thanks so much Laura! It’s also a very heavy topic for me. I’ve always had 3 or 4 “quality” friends. I’ve never been one to have a “few hundred” friends. Yes - I’ve had acquaintances and colleagues but those are different.
My friends are my family and I treat them as such. In my early adult life, I had different expectations I think. But honestly as everything does eventually change, friendahips can as well. They change, shift, adapt, pivot into different forms and kinds.
As we get older, it’s very different to make new friends. Everybody’s lives seem to be more complicated, busier, and maybe not as flexible.
I have been hurt very deeply by friends and maybe even more so than romantic relationships. I treasure them in a very different way. I know specifically after one heartache, I did change my expectations from friends. And to this day I do remind myself of that.
Being sober and through out my recovery journey, friendships are even more challenging and I will continue that in another comment.
This is really neat to have this forum and someone I respect so much inviting me to chime in with my thoughts so I appreciate this - and you!
1) My first thoughts and feelings when I think of friendships in my life today... well, a smile comes to my face. I am thinking of my recent birthday party where I had so many nerves and anxiety that people wouldn't come, or if they came they wouldn't have a good time, I certainly didn't expect them to bring me gifts, etc and the result was such a wonderful lovely time where I had the perfect mix of friends show up - from my very best friend since middle school (I was so thrilled she came because she has a busy life as a mom and lives an hour away - this friendship I had a story that I always needed to be the one to come to HER and not put the burden on asking her to come to MY things), to my work colleagues that I formed a friendship with over the past year and half, to my gaggle of theatre friends, to my friend from vet school, to my new romantic partner. I cried when everyone left tears of such gratitude while reading my birthday cards. It was a reminder that I am loved and in the voice of Stewart Smiley - gosh darnit, people like me!
2) The role of my friendships in terms of my support system - I would say pretty important/even with my family and new romantic partnership. Especially my work bestie who I can text with about cases and they "get it". That has been really helpful.
3) I'm comfortable with ebbs and flows
4) I like a tight circle, but that is expanding some as I make more and more connections in theatre. I was really struck by observing the guy I'm dating who is an extrovert and I swear has more friends than anyone I have ever met and seems to actually be close with most of them, not just random party acquaintances etc. It's such a stark difference to me and has been so interesting to observe and reflect on and is something I like about him.
5) Possibly in middle school or something, no deep wounds are coming to mind. Of my friendships that didn't last, most just sort of peetered out as we aged and found other interests or moved or whatever. Some of them I can reconnect with years later and it's like no time has passed and others I never had a chance or motivation to reconnect with.
One thing that I am so thrilled about in sobriety is how I didn't lose any friendships. I am comfortable bringing NA alternatives to gatherings etc and so all my friendships just carried on, most with not a lot of discussion around my decision to get sober.
This one is big for me right now. My childhood best friend and I had a break up around 12 years ago. She set a boundary that I misinterpreted as rejection. I was in a tough period with my husband (we separated at the time and this friend did NOT support my staying in the marriage). Looking back now, I see how brave she was in setting this boundary and removing her friendship/support. I felt betrayed and so angry. It wasn't until I stopped drinking (10 years later) that I re-examined all of this and had a different perspective. While my husband and I worked through a LOT and grew a ton, I now can recognize that she was putting her well being first (it hurt her too much to see me abuse myself and stay stuck - I was in a bad place). About a year after getting sober, she called me to tell me she has breast cancer. The first words out of my mouth were, "I love you and I'm so sorry." I didn't miss a beat, could not harbor any of the old resentment and I just needed her to know that I am here and I don't care that we had drifted. The last 12 months have been us repairing our friendship and it has been beautiful. And one of my biggest lessons in recovery.
This is a fraught one for me at the moment. I was heartbroken by the friends who were just not there for me when my daughter became seriously unwell. It is true what they say - no one brings you a casserole when your child has a mental illness. It is shocking when it happens and for me coping with the distress at feeling abandoned was the second worst thing about my daughters illness (the worst being her suffering and the suffering of our whole family).
I am grateful that some other friends were rock solid, including one who had been more of an acquaintance and who just became a lifeline.
I am very sure that I have not always been there for my friends so I continue to work on getting over what happened with my friends but im not sure that I will.
This is an interesting topic, as since becoming sober its changed. I need to remind myself that change is a process. I'm a different friend now i'm sober.
I find myself wanting more connection, more truth, more love, more and my current circle of friends not being able to step up. Its a process.....
1. friendship in my life today is both invaluable and lacking; It's neither hurt nor comfort- I have some friendships but its an area of opportunity that I'm actively trying to improve post-getting sober
2. I'm seeing more and more how important close friendships are and what it takes to keep them close, and wishing I'd put more effort and time into them rather than backburner them at the expense of my relationship and own inability to be vulnerable
3. I'm mostly comfortable with them and don't require constant contact, but am realizing that for others this can be seen as not being close or not caring
4. somewhere in between, I haven't had that tight-knit 'friends' style group since high-school or college
5. not in adulthood, just gradual growing apart (although as I typed this I almost forgot about the one who cheated with my significant other, which I wouldn't categorize as a friend breakup but do realize it led to some serious trust issues)
Navigating adult friendships after getting sober and realizing how much connection I didn't have in active drinking and how many friendships I lost because of it, has been so hard. There are a few that have always been there but I never really let people 'in' for a very long time, and am actively trying to fix that now. It's hard and lonely. It's not exactly what you described below, not friendships as fill-ins, but as far as time and energy spent my friendships have always tapered and taken a backseat to my relationships, which I regret even as I'm married and happy in that space.
As a source of comfort, I think about a quote my best friend in Chicago of 30 years sent me recently on friendship, the basically said that in your 40s your good friendships basically get sized down to a single dot. Like your really close friendships. And it makes me laugh - it’s probably true, too. We see each other about 4 times per year and integrate each other into our own families, but she is one of my top 5 most important people in my life, for sure. Lately I have become kind of a housecat and am busy with work, kids, being sober - and my casual group of girlfriends, my social network, has drifted off. I know they are still doing the same things, but I have changed, and I’m okay with that. I’ve gotten closer to my kids, closer to people that I play tennis with, since we share that in common, and close to a few people at work. I’m good with that. As a source of hurt and anxiety, I often think about my 14yo daughter when you ask a friendships, and MAN she is having a TIME, as a freshman at a new school. She had a wonderful time at summer school, and then the worst first month of school ever with a couple of groups of girls, and they can get SO MEAN. She inserted herself as the freshman counselor, of which she is completely not qualified, and on shaky legs to begin with, and every bad and worse thing that could have happened, did. She was basically told to get herself out of all of this perpetuating drama, or leave school - it was hard telling her that much of what she was doing wasn’t “wrong” but that she needed to stop inserting herself on what was right, and get distance from what all was going on. She is also trapped in the things we tell ourselves, and having to own some of her own mistakes. Makes me hurt for her. And yet, she is the one at lunch who will walk up to anyone to make a friend. Funny that you ask about breakups with friends - my husband of 25yrs has always been a priority to me, and my best friend, and others have kind of drifted in and out with that. I have left a lot of people behind, which I would like to change as I become more independent, but no, as an adult I haven’t had a bad breakup with a friend.
Such mixed feelings about this topic because I have only now really started to trust female friendship after a lifetime of being treated horribly by friends in my past. Now I have 2 friends I trust, but my primary relationships are my partner and my sisters. I am 4 years sober, and I am feeling confident enough to be a lot more deliberate about friendships. So if I meet a woman I think is a good fit, I am making a conscious effort to pursue friendships, which is totally new for me. But it is difficult to find friends who aren't wine moms as a personality.
I believe it is up to me to get out in community and get involved in activities that bring people together.
I am in long term recovery and am separated from my husband of 25 years. Working through grief and loss is a highly sensitive space to be alone in, but I imagine more common than not, especially when your doing the work that involves childhood trauma.
I am in a psycho drama group and I have a recovery coach, so there is that support.
I am ok being alone, but to find the people that have compassion and live with truth and vulnerability are rare finds. You would think in the recovery world one would have an easier time being seen.
I am a Seattle native, in my early 60's, very open and easy going. Love being out in nature with my regal hound, it would be so nice to meet up for a nice convo:)
Thanks Laura! Yes, the story is still being written and attachment is such a key theme. Thanks for reminding me of that word, sums me up to a T 😉
Someone responded that they were having trouble leaving a comment (hi, Kristin Kent!) so I'm posting this with her permission:
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Hello, Laura sent a callout about friendship. I can't leave a comment for some reason, so here it is. If you could forward, please and thanks.
Great topic, Laura.
The first thing that comes up for me with friendship is loneliness. Friends, to me, are situational. I have one friend I could share anything with. One. And because of our schedules we don't prioritize each other. I'm envious of people with girlfriends, with a solid group they see often, and can depend on.
I feel alone a lot. I'm used to it, it's been like this for a long time. I tried to shape-shift myself to belong for many years, often feeling rejected because I could really never make friendships stick. So I went to 'locals' where I knew other people would constantly be there, that I could talk to. They were never friends, but at least they were there.
I'm older now, and don't see myself making 'true' friendships at this point in my life. It's painful to think about, and it's a topic I avoid. So, what comes up for me? Loneliness.
Thanks for asking,
Kristin
I treasure my friendships and I work hard to make sure they are kept fairly strong. I have a small handful of life-long friends that I still, after 40+ years, keep in touch with and see, a couple more than the other two. My husband actually gets jealous of how much time I spend trying to find time to spend with my friends. I love him, and he is a great husband, but it isn't that same as my Girlfriends. I have had some friends come and go in my life, which at the time hurt a lot, but one moves on. :)
Friendship feels like a bottomless need for me. I can never seem to feel full of it or secure in it. I make friends easily and have many, yet my desire for deep, authentic connection (and attention TBH) feels too much. I am always working to fill my own cup. In sobriety, I lost two 40 year friendships that were like family to me. One was complete cut off (not my choice) and the other was a slow fade. I am left so confused, angry, disappointed, hurt, and more. Codependency and people pleasing are my middle names, a constant work in progress. My husband is the best companion but he is not my girlfriend. I have made new friends and great connection in sobriety, but I had a long history with my lifelong girlfriends that can't be replaced. I don't have a full understanding of what happened and I never will. It is really hard for me to let go. Thanks for bringing up this topic, Laura!
My friendships are a source of tremendous strength for me. I have a small circle (4-6) folks who know everything about my journey & who I trust with my life. I also have a broader circle of good friends & acquaintances. Over the past 5 years I have fought very hard to be a good friend & to build strong connections. I know that I am very fortunate & I don’t take the relationships for granted. These friendships transcend romantic relationships & are a constant in my life. I also ended two friendships that just were just not supportive - always critical - never positive- mean to others. Difficult decisions - but such a relief after it was done.
Personally, I'm really curious about a phenomenon I noticed pretty early on: that some women (and I'm sure men and non-binary folks too, but please comment?) valued their friendships as much (and sometimes more!) as romantic partnerships while others seemed to use friendships more as fill-ins until they found a partner, at which point they'd basically bounce.